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candlemass
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PostSubject: NWOBHM   Thu Nov 24, 2016 12:25 pm

Never was much of a fan of this scene, absolutely hated Iron Maiden! Then I picked up "Piece of Mind" and was blown away! One Bruce joined they left that scene. NWOBHM is punk infused metal, and I don't like punk rock. Saxon were the best at it, and as I noted in another thread, I was not much of a Saxon fan back then, but dug the classic cuts. As Biff noted in the liner notes from the re-issue of "Innocence is no Excuse", they had moved on from that scene by then. In fact, every band that survived that scene moved on from it, it had a rather short shelf life...
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Wurthless
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PostSubject: Re: NWOBHM   Thu Nov 24, 2016 2:43 pm

dude, NWOBHM is so much more than punk-infused metal... and Maiden is simply the one NWOBHM band that really blew up.

listen to some deeper cuts to get a better idea of the movement. the real substance of the movement, imo, is in the underground bands that never saw any real success. a lot of the "cult" stuff was raw, heavy, speedy, and fun. their lo-fi DIY attitude is more exemplary of the sound associated with the movement than bands like Saxon, Maiden, and Def Leppard who gained more popularity than their peers.









all just my opinion, of course.
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chewie
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PostSubject: Re: NWOBHM   Thu Nov 24, 2016 3:56 pm

Saracen.... They're on the proggy side of that scene. Great album! All good tunes posted there!
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Wurthless
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PostSubject: Re: NWOBHM   Thu Nov 24, 2016 4:00 pm

Yeah that Saracen album is like 70s & early 80s metal meets Kansas, and it's f*cking awesome. One of my favorites of any genre.
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PostSubject: Re: NWOBHM   Thu Nov 24, 2016 5:38 pm

Not a huge NWOBHM fan myself aswell. But there are some gems just like in any other genre - Virtue, Omega, Saracen, Tokyo Blade's first two albums, Praying Mantis with Time Tells no Lies and others. What I like about them is that they were clearly infuenced by other music and it shows in their own recordings being different than your average poorly produced NWOBHM single from 1979-80.
On a related note, this song alone is better than entire Saxons discography
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Wrecked Neck
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PostSubject: Re: NWOBHM   Thu Nov 24, 2016 6:20 pm

I love it, there was just some pure magic with a lot of bands back then. Bands like Satan, Blitzkrieg, Angel Witch, Cloven Hoof, Raven etc were amazing bands. Tons more I could name, but those were some of my favorites. I hear very little punk in any of those bands. But I like a lot of punk too, so wouldn't bother me anyways. \'arry \'eadbanger
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candlemass
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PostSubject: Re: NWOBHM   Thu Nov 24, 2016 6:59 pm

Despite the vehement protests of Steve Harris, Iron Maiden certainly had punk influence while Paul was fronting the band, and they only blew up when they departed from that scene and picked up a human air siren for a vocalist! Like all scenes, there are bound to be some gems in there. Having said that, it's no real mystery why a lot of bands didn't make it out, like Diamond Head, they never evolved...
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Glower
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PostSubject: Re: NWOBHM   Thu Nov 24, 2016 8:14 pm

Those were some very interesting tunes posted.
Saracen was quite fun to listen to !
Post a few more bands, please Smile
Also, as a side note...
There is something charming about a poorly recorded band...
I mean , the technology, and studio capabilities...
It always sets me a dreaming....of how it truly was....
And how fast the scene zoomed by....
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HeavyThrashhead
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PostSubject: Re: NWOBHM   Thu Nov 24, 2016 9:52 pm

while i can't disagree that the NWOBHM movement had a punk diy attitude, but that is just it, a movement, you had your punkish sounding bands, you had your Hard Rock-type bands, you had your Prog type bands, but then you had ones that pushed the boundaries of said music, Raven and Venom pushed it to levels that was unheard of, going on to influencing Thrash Metal and othe forms of Extreme Metal (mostly on Venom's part).

but of course you had Iron Maiden and Def Leppard who saw popularity in America, Iron Maiden taking more of a epic metal sound durring Bruce Dickinson's era of the band while Def Leppard was gaining fame with the hair metal scene. of course Saxon was getting popularity, but mostly in europe still, but little in America.

but to me, it's not about how many you sell, it's about how good you are, this whole f*cking "there is a reason why said band did not make it" to me is redundant, just a poor excuse to make an opinion higher than others. now there are some band's within' the movement that are very overhyped (Virtue...i'm looking at YOU!) but there are some good exeptions, one's that have been mentioned here already, like Tokyo Blade (at least their early material before they dipped into mediocrity with their poppy metal material), Satan, Blizkrieg, Angel Witch (though highly ranked, but still deserving of it), Legend and Cloven Hoof (80's up to like 2006 is where i like 'em, everything after is suck ass).

other ones i also really enjoy are More, Tygers of Pan Tang (though everything before The Cage), Warfare (much like Venom), Tank, Demon Pact, Fist, Vardis, Jaguar, Witchfynde, Le Griffe, Atomkraft, Avenger, Deep Machine, Grim Reaper, Halland, Hammer, Hollow Ground, Lone Wolf, Persian Risk, Preyer, Quartz, Sledgehammer, Weapon & Wolf (originally as Black Axe).
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80s Metal Lady
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PostSubject: Re: NWOBHM   Thu Nov 24, 2016 10:30 pm

My favorite sub genre of music. So much great stuff. Some bands only released a couple demos, but I enjoy searching for songs by obscure NWOBHM bands and adding them to my rotation.

Here's one of my favorites:



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candlemass
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PostSubject: Re: NWOBHM   Thu Nov 24, 2016 10:35 pm

No love for Raven nor Venom, I don't care who they influenced, can't stand them.
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candlemass
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PostSubject: Re: NWOBHM   Thu Nov 24, 2016 10:38 pm

Ok, it's more than the punk infusion, since that was certainly prevalent in thrash and grunge, both of which I liked. So what was it that I didn't like about it? Not really sure, the production? Eh, not so great in the early thrash days either, I don't know man, just know I likes what I likes...
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candlemass
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PostSubject: Re: NWOBHM   Thu Nov 24, 2016 10:39 pm

Oh, don't like Motorhead either... sick
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manny
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PostSubject: Re: NWOBHM   Thu Nov 24, 2016 10:48 pm

While I disagree with Candlemass, on his dislike of Motorhead and Raven, I think he has a point, the bands that outlasted the scene, not just Iron Maiden, Saxon and Def Leppard, but bands such as Raven, Venom moved away from the scene, while other bands such as Satan, Fist and host of others died when the scene died. In just a few years what seemed new and exciting became yesterday's news.
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HeavyThrashhead
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PostSubject: Re: NWOBHM   Thu Nov 24, 2016 11:35 pm

sure it's debatable on wheather the band's had to move on to get a shot but the key reason to why the movement died was not because band's tried to move from it.

Diamond Head was mentioned and they did try to evolve but the way they chose is what bit 'em, instaid of pushing into a more heavier or metallic dirrection they went for a friendly, proggish sound and it hurt 'em to where people left 'em, they did try to move forward but their unreleased demos from 1984 showed that they were trying way too hard with going into a dirrection that Queen did and that was disco (yes, Diamond Head ALMOST went ahead for it) but realised that it would have not worked since it did not work for Queen so they disspanded instaid of releasing something that was regain their popularity. then they came back in the 90's wich was not a forgiving time for classic metal bands, just a bad time, even if their material from the 1990's was good, people would have not known, the good shit practically went back into the underground in those days.

Raven on the other side also tried going for a poppy sound with The Pack is Back wich as well did not work in Raven's favor and after that they went back to playing Metal music again, while they did not regain all of their fanbase back (that's how much The Pack is back bombed) but here in 2015 they are still getting love 'cos of 'em sticking with the sound of their early works.

it ain't 'cos of band's evolving why the scene died, it's 'cos of certain bands making bad decisions, not every band can go for the sucsess of Iron Maiden or Def Leppard (though, their core fanbase had left 'em long, long ago back in 1983) but due to certain bands such as Tygers of Pan Tang, Diamond Head, Raven, and such and such making bad decision after bad decision it hurt the movement and why it died, maybe if those bands had stuck to their guns instaid of persuing in the direction of Def Leppard it would had lasted longer.

bands such as Satan did not die because of them not evolving, they died people were tired of the one's they liked that ended up releasing crap that they lost all interest to where Hair Metal and Thrash getting bigger to then overshadowing it. now of course Satan has been gaining alot more attention than they ever did back in the 80's but that is due to people digging into the vaults of the movement to finding a hidden gem and now they have now become a recording and touring machine and rightfully deserve the praise, but of course you have people who say they are boring and what not but that is their opinion and i have no problem with that.
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John Madden
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PostSubject: Re: NWOBHM   Sat Nov 26, 2016 2:49 am

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PostSubject: Re: NWOBHM   Sat Nov 26, 2016 11:04 pm

My favorite music is from this movement and encompasses 500+ bands playing a bewildering variety of metal from doom to prog to pop to thrash. If you think NWOBHM is "punk infused metal" you know very little about the movement.
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Wrecked Neck
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PostSubject: Re: NWOBHM   Sat Nov 26, 2016 11:16 pm

Witchfinder wrote:
If you think NWOBHM is "punk infused metal" you know very little about the movement.
Yeah I never really thought there was much punk in it. You might say that about some thrash bands, and yes early pre-Bruce maiden, but for the most part I would say if anything there is a lot of power metal in the whole NWOBHM movement.
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candlemass
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PostSubject: Re: NWOBHM   Sun Nov 27, 2016 6:29 pm

I really don't hear much power in it...
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Witchfinder
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PostSubject: Re: NWOBHM   Sun Nov 27, 2016 7:57 pm

manny wrote:
While I disagree with Candlemass, on his dislike of Motorhead and Raven, I think he has a point, the bands that outlasted the scene, not just Iron Maiden, Saxon and Def Leppard, but bands such as Raven, Venom moved away from the scene, while other bands such as Satan, Fist and host of others died when the scene died. In just a few years what seemed new and exciting became yesterday's news.

You've just described every musical movement ever. That's how it works. A few bands become successful and the rest fail.

Also, the NWOBHM produced two of the highest selling bands of all time - Iron Maiden and Def Leppard. That's not such a failure if you ask me.
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PostSubject: Re: NWOBHM   Sun Nov 27, 2016 7:58 pm

candlemass wrote:
I really don't hear much power in it...

It appears you've only listened to a handful of NWOBHM bands.
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Wurthless
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PostSubject: Re: NWOBHM   Mon Nov 28, 2016 1:38 am

Just dropping in to give Glower more of what he asked for... also Candlemass, listen to Blind Fury to get a taste of one of the slew of bands from the NWOBHM scene that was very power-metal oriented.









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candlemass
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PostSubject: Re: NWOBHM   Mon Nov 28, 2016 7:36 am

Yea ok, by 85 they cleaned up the sound a bit...
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candlemass
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PostSubject: Re: NWOBHM   Mon Nov 28, 2016 7:39 am

Witchfinder wrote:
manny wrote:
While I disagree with Candlemass, on his dislike of Motorhead and Raven, I think he has a point, the bands that outlasted the scene, not just Iron Maiden, Saxon and Def Leppard, but bands such as Raven, Venom moved away from the scene, while other bands such as Satan, Fist and host of others died when the scene died. In just a few years what seemed new and exciting became yesterday's news.

You've just described every musical movement ever.  That's how it works.  A few bands become successful and the rest fail.

Also, the NWOBHM produced two of the highest selling bands of all time - Iron Maiden and Def Leppard.  That's not such a failure if you ask me.

Yet neither of those bands had their success while in that scene playing that style of music, in fact, Joe Elliot has said they wanted nothing to do w/it...
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PostSubject: Re: NWOBHM   Mon Nov 28, 2016 8:48 am

candlemass wrote:
Witchfinder wrote:
manny wrote:
While I disagree with Candlemass, on his dislike of Motorhead and Raven, I think he has a point, the bands that outlasted the scene, not just Iron Maiden, Saxon and Def Leppard, but bands such as Raven, Venom moved away from the scene, while other bands such as Satan, Fist and host of others died when the scene died. In just a few years what seemed new and exciting became yesterday's news.

You've just described every musical movement ever.  That's how it works.  A few bands become successful and the rest fail.

Also, the NWOBHM produced two of the highest selling bands of all time - Iron Maiden and Def Leppard.  That's not such a failure if you ask me.

Yet neither of those bands had their success while in that scene playing that style of music, in fact, Joe Elliot has said they wanted nothing to do w/it...

Huh?  Def Leppard made no appreciable change to their sound from Getcha Rocks Off to Pyromania.  They merely had better production. Iron Maiden simply changed to a singer with more range.  Also, do you determine what bands you like based on which bands transcended a genre and became successful?  That seems like a very odd way to decide what bands you like.

You misunderstand NWOBHM completely.  It's not a "sound" or "style" at all.  It's 500+ bands from a single country (mostly) that all exploded onto the scene from 1979-1984 playing a myriad of styles.  For instance these are both songs from NWOBHM bands:





Those don't sound anything alike.  Witchfinder General is a doom band and Praying Mantis is almost AOR.  Neither are "punk infused thrash" at all.  

Saying you don't like NWOBHM is akin to saying you dont' like Metal because there are so many different types of styles being played.
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